(edit title) Is Sweden an Apartheid State? De Facto and De jure any difference? Options

[krigeren]

Stop global over-population.From a Swedish perspective, we have always been open to people moving here from other countries. It has never been that big of an issue because it ... (show full quote)

Stop global over-population.

From a Swedish perspective, we have always been open to people moving here from other countries. It has never been that big of an issue because it looked like we would maintain an essentially Swedish culture with a bunch of smaller cultural groups mixed in.

Now that the world's population is pushing 7 billion people, and rising steadily, we are coming to the realisation that Swedish culture is going to be a historical footnote soon.

It would probably bother me a lot more if I wasn't so heavily sedated. ... (hide full quote)

Sedated??

Trowbridge and I are going to disagree with you about this assessment. The actions that appear to spark wars are nearly always engineered to provide a rallying cry. When Hitle ... (show full quote)

Trowbridge and I are going to disagree with you about this assessment. The actions that appear to spark wars are nearly always engineered to provide a rallying cry.

When Hitler needed an excuse to invade Poland, he sent some German army troops across the border wearing Polish army uniforms to fire on German troops, so he could galvanise German public support for his war.

Wars are a product of power struggles between two (or more) empowered groups. The powerless almost never rise up, by the way. Usually the second most powerful group challenges the most powerful group, or the most powerful group senses the power of the second most powerful group and lashes out to pre-empt a power grab by their rival(s).

I agree that war is unlikely in Scandinavia, though. The future has already been determined, and there is no going back now. ... (hide full quote)

Its a matter of semantics. Actions could mean planning...etc..something that leads up to execution. Sitting around and talking about it, as we are now, won't cause the action leading to planning or execution..I agree with you.

[Gustav- Fælbönnran]

Yes, sedated.

I typically only manage to post here when I am wrapping up business trips, and getting ready to fly home. I like to be fully sedated before getting into one of those metal death-traps that are commonly referred to as aeroplanes. To this end, I consume as many adult beverages as I can tolerate, in search of a blissful lack of concern for my own situation. The only downside to this strategy, is that I tend to make up a lot of stories about Trowbridge's exploits in Cuba in the 1950s when I am in this state.

I want to make it perfectly clear that it is not because I am afraid of Death. Death is my friend. I just don't like the thought of falling out of the sky, with the ground rushing up at tremendous speed. It makes me uncomfortable.

[Gustav- Fælbönnran]

The sun rose slowly over the Cayo Levisa, as if the great fireball could sense the violence and chaos about to unfold, and had misgivings about proceding.

In the dawn’s early light, two figures could be observed emerging from the waves, clad head to toe in black rubber wetsuits. As the men reached the beach, they quickly scurried towards the nearest pile of brush and concealed their tanks and other apparatus.

Silently, the two men examined their map and compass. The shockingly blond, distinguished looking man was the first to speak.

“Nice work, Crap-head. Do you realize what you have done? Your lousy navigational skills have put us on the entirely wrong beach. You cretin! You imbecile! We’re nowhere near the SS-4 site at San Cristobal.”

“I,I, I merely meant to…” stammered Trowbridge’s larger, red-bearded assistant.

“Oh, shut up already, you useless buffoon.” Responded the professor. “I suppose I will have to get us out of this jam, as per usual.”

“Look”, said Trowbridge, “There is a passing bus, let’s see if it goes to San Cristobal”

With that, the two agents jogged over to the bus stop and manfully mounted the steps. The bus driver, mirrored in their Ray-bans, extended a hand for the fare.

“Gustav, don’t just stand there. Pay the man for our tickets.” Exhorted the professor.

Dutifully, the big Jamt reached into his billfold and extracted a thick wad of greenbacks. “How much do you think it is?” Queried the Jamt.

The sight of the US currency produced an immediate response from the riders of the bus. Until this moment, neither of our two protagonists had noticed that the side of the bus was adorned with the label “Fuerzas Armadas Revolucionarias”. Our strapping heroes had blundered onto a transport of the Revolutionary Guard!

Immediately the large Jamt was overpowered by several of these guards. The stalwart professor, an expert in the esoteric oriental arts of self-defense, managed to bite and gouge four or five guards before they subdued him with a fisherman’s net from a nearby wharf. Within moments, both agents were stripped naked, and buried in sand up to their necks.

By the third day of their ungainly confinement, they began to have serious concerns for their well-being. Fortunately, the local fishermen, who had earlier gambled for the agents' clothes and gear, began to take pity on them. Eventually, one of the fishermen sent his daughter, Mariela, to bring them some dried fish and tequila.
Gustav, used to the cooler clime of Jamtland, was nearly delusional in the baking heat, but, as usual, Dr. Ford had managed to keep his wits about him. When he saw Mariela approach, he quickly began to win her over.

“Hey, Chiquita” began Dr. Ford “Quiero volar contigo, Tocar tu ombligo Y pachanguear contigo.”

Mariela immediately picked up an oar from her father’s rowboat, and delivered a tremendous wallop to the noggin of the professor. And for good measure, she clobbered the stocky Jamt as well.

Minutes later, as the two agents regained their senses, Trowbridge noticed that he could now, as a result of being struck, wiggle about in the sand a little bit.

“Good news, Gus! I have freed us!” “Once night falls, we will be able to extricate ourselves from this earthen prison and abscond with one of those yonder rowboats.”

And so they did. They were unable to dis-able any rocket launchers on that trip, but they were able to provide General Curtis LeMay with some detailed descriptions of places where he might want to drop bombs if the opportunity arose.

--------------------------------------------

There are lots more of these escapades in the files, but I am getting a little groggy, and will need to sign off. Vaya con Dios, Dr. Ford y Mariela.

[Blackman_for_Blondes]

"I agree that war is unlikely in Scandinavia, though. The future has already been determined, and there is no going back now."

I was in Jamaica last summer I tell you one thing you know when civil war (and I agree its usually a power struggle between the two top groups) is in the air you feel it smell it and its makes you afraid, its not nice..people here in Sweden are hopefully too civilised for that degrading human madness called war. Also no one knows the future we could be hit by a giant meteorite tomorrow, for example so much for immigration then...lol

[*Guest*]

Damit, security has just informed me of this gross violation of our vital secrets.

Every time Gus goes on a secret mission to Cuba, apparently to arrange some way of breaking the American embargo, he always gets high when he leaves, thinking that he has finally closed out the Cold War, starting to recall our past operations in very self-serrving ways.

Of course, he doesn't translate, as usual, what I suggested to Mariela, and if LeMay had bombed the coordinates I provided, no Cuban would have been killed because they were those of what is left of the Bay of Pigs. The mad bomber never checked such details, he just took off, and let fly.

Don't expect any improvements from Gus, as he still seems to be loaded, reminiscing about all the culture problems facing the Sami and the Swedes. The Jamtlander is already one of the world's forgotten.

[krigeren]

"I agree that war is unlikely in Scandinavia, though. The future has already been determined, and there is no going back now."I was in Jamaica last summer I tell you ... (show full quote)

"I agree that war is unlikely in Scandinavia, though. The future has already been determined, and there is no going back now."

I was in Jamaica last summer I tell you one thing you know when civil war (and I agree its usually a power struggle between the two top groups) is in the air you feel it smell it and its makes you afraid, its not nice..people here in Sweden are hopefully too civilised for that degrading human madness called war. Also no one knows the future we could be hit by a giant meteorite tomorrow, for example so much for immigration then...lol ... (hide full quote)

Swedes have to realize they are dependent upon a large immigrant labor force for their future in terms of supporting the Welfare State.

I was at an ALMI meeting the other night for start up companies. Of the 50 or so people there maybe 4 were ethnic Swedes. The rapper Falafelmannen was there as well...

He shared many of the same thoughts I have...There are no jobs for the youth here so we have no choice but to start our own companies or leave, if you come from an immigrant background trebly so". The whole event was hosted by in large people with immigrant backgrounds.

Its clear that new companies and the new ideas that drive those companies are coming in large part from foreigners here. The Swedes are missing out...in a generation or two the foreigners will hold vast sums of wealth and in turn they will want eqv. power...the Californication of Sweden is alive and well ;-)

[mikmak]

The Swedes are missing out...in a generation or two the foreigners will hold vast sums of wealth and in turn they will want eqv. power...the Californication of Sweden is alive and well ;-)

In a generation or two they could hardly be considered "foreigners"...

[krigeren]

Are you not aware of the massive rift that exists between children born in Sweden to two immigrant parents and the rest of the group especially when the kids have dark skin?

Why would anyone feel they have to change their name to fit in?

I think if a famous ethnic Swede changes their name to a ethnic name Like "Nenad Holtvic" as part of a campaign to raise discrimination awareness it would help quite a bit...

I speak to Swedes all the time who openly admit their is prejudice, racism, exclusion in this country and its been that way for decades. Such issues need to be exposed, poked, prodded and let light shine on them until they are dead and gone.

[VikingHumpingWitch]

Primarily I want to see immigrants and minorities gaining positions of power within the society based upon their merit.

Erm well isn't that exactly what we have? I know immigrants who have good jobs in Sweden. They all have the merit of speaking good Swedish. If you can't speak good (not just fluent, but good) Swedish and haven't got a job then quite frankly, it's because you're lacking in the necessary merits.

If it's ok for you to hire "blacks and Arabs" ahead of Brits and Americans purely because you think the former have a bit more oomph in them then you really cannot comoplain that Swedish employers favour people who speak the fricking language over those who don't.

[Streja]

It will get better in the future. There is always a threat from Nazis but most Swedes are not like that. What they want to keep i Swedish culture and traditions. They want to have the end of the school year celebrations in church for instance. They want to raise the flag the 6th of June and celebrate Midsummer. They want to invite "foreigners" to this party but they are sometimes shy or reserved. They want foreigners to like something about Sweden.

[krigeren]

Erm well isn't that exactly what we have? I know immigrants who have good jobs in Sweden. They all have the merit of speaking good Swedish. If you can't speak good (no ... (show full quote)

Erm well isn't that exactly what we have? I know immigrants who have good jobs in Sweden. They all have the merit of speaking good Swedish. If you can't speak good (not just fluent, but good) Swedish and haven't got a job then quite frankly, it's because you're lacking in the necessary merits.

If it's ok for you to hire "blacks and Arabs" ahead of Brits and Americans purely because you think the former have a bit more oomph in them then you really cannot comoplain that Swedish employers favour people who speak the fricking language over those who don't. ... (hide full quote)

This is where it will change and the immigrants will change it...

Logic...

You work for an international company who sells products all over the world or has the intention to. The working language will be in most cases English.

Illogical...

You work for an international company in Sweden and you must speak Swedish to work there when the whole point of the company is to export products abroad. A company such as that wants a common language, i.e., the lingua franca of business...English...so everyone can communicate and participate. In fact...you want people who speak languages of the countries you are exporting too more so than there is a need for Swedish in those organizations. ..
...
Overall...even if one does go through the ropes of learning great Swedish and lands themselves a job in their vocation here..they end up in a company with Swedish managers and limited opportunities. Besides, Swedish professionals are poorly paid compared to UK/US/ETC..it seems the only option for immigrants here is to open their own businesses if they want to realize their dreams here...running their companies in the language of their choice.

[VikingHumpingWitch]

The thing you perhaps don't realise is that the vast majority of Sweden's trade is with other Nordic countries. Nordic languages are therefore more useful than English, much as we English speakers might find this incomprehensible and impossible to believe.

Sweden's job market is more limited than that of other countries, but it's still a market. If you have the skills needed you will find a job. If you don't, you won't. Same as everywhere else. It just so happens that one of the skills needed is good Swedish. If you don't have good Swedish then you put yourself in a very limited market position, which is fine, but don't then complain about where you've put yourself.

And ya know, anyone can learn Swedish. I have seen small children and people who are very, very stupid speaking fluent Swedish. It might take you longer and require more effort than someone else, but you can do it. There really are no excuses here.

[Streja]

krigeren, most Swedish multinationals already use English as their business language. What's your point?

It really depends on what the British/Canadian/American immigrant wants to work with. Plus if he wants to be able to follow the news, become friends with Swedes, learn the culture etc then he probably needs a little bit of Swedish.

Have you got anything against learning Swedish or using Swedish? I love my language and want to be able to use it in my own country. I also love English and use it on a daily basis. I also speak Spanish.

[Gustav- Fælbönnran]

I also speak Spanish.

E-

Did you happen to catch my deft use of Spanish in my "The sun rose slowly over the Cayo Levisa..." story earlier in this thread? Not exactly textbook grammar and vocabulary, but I felt very multicultural for a moment there.

G.

[Streja]

Erhm, it was too long-winded so I decided not to finish reading it.