(edit title) Cycling on the road... legal? Using the road when there is a bike path Options

[Jules]

Again whats with the bile vented at cyclists? I don't mind constructive criticism. There probably should be some sort of test required before a cyclist uses the road, but there isn't. It probably should be a legal requirement to wear a helmet, but its not. Some cyclists are Aholes with no respect for pedestrians, but some drivers are too. Some cycle paths are put in ridiculous places and take up space or cost money where they are not needed, but I as a cyclist don't mark out where they should be put.
Why do you feel its OK to take this all out on someone who is legally going about their business by acting in a potentially or deliberately harmful and illegal manner? If you don't like it you have the ability to change things via a democratic system. The country you have chosen to live in has decided to support cycling and cyclists, either start your legal campaign against it, or suck it up and move on. There are plenty of things the government spends my tax money on that I would rather they didn't, and there are plenty of laws that I do not agree with. However I understand that I have a choice, I can stay here and abide by the rules, or I can choose to leave and go somewhere more suited to my views, pretty simple really.
I personally happen to dislike the very high proportion of drivers here who contary to all common sense and I belive their legal obligation fail to indicate before turning, however I would not cycle up behind them and try and damage them or their cars because of it, nor would I hold a grudge against every car driver because of those idiots. Again those showing these aggressive anti cyclist tendencies from behind a keyboard or behind the wheel are pathetic, I can bet you wouldn't walk up to me just before I got on my bike and try that without the protection of a 2 ton car. If you don't like cycling fine, there are plenty of things I don't like either. If you don't like all cyclists then you are as big a fool as somone who claims they don't like all bakers. But if you actively go out looking to hurt people who are going about their legal business, or condone those who do, then you are in my opinoin, scum, plain and simple.

[Seamus Sean]

As I made clear in my earlier posts, before my admirer interrupted me, I´m on rg´s side on this one.

Alas I can´t produce the law of the land concerning the rights of cyclists in Sweden but common manners and common sense must prevail when encountering cyclists on a road, same as when you meet someone on horseback.

Slow down, take stock of the situation, and when safe to do so overtake.

Check your mirrors, indicate, and move out, leaving enough space between you and the cyclist to allow for the unexpected, pull back into your lane and continue with your journey, simple really.

Oh and for the benefit of a lot of the drivers I´ve seen on Swedish roads your indicators are the blinking lights found front and rear on your car, dead handy for letting other road user know which way you intend to take with your car.

Would these "brave" posters who want to inflict injury to cyclists react the same way when meeting someone on horse back? I doubt it as the horse may kick back if they drove too close to them!

I think rg was dead right in what he said about the posters wishing harm to others here, if confronted face to face they wouldn´t say boo to a goose...key board warriors tend to be less brave when having to deal with real people!

And on a related topic, I was wondering how many world class cyclists Sweden have produced over the years?

Just curious is all.

[AgeOfReason]

Would these "brave" posters who want to inflict injury to cyclists

Those brave posters should leave the cyclists to themselves since most accident injuries to cyclists are caused by-themselves:

http://www.dn.se/nyheter/sverige/fler-skad...n-i-bilolyckor/

[Wes]

I find the views of many of you appalling and a the view that its ok to run over bikers.

In June of this year I had an accident involving a car that didn’t see me on the bike path, I tore both my knee ligaments had inflammation in both arms and 3 cracked ribs, is this OK?

I am also a road biker and where possible I use the bike path but on many areas it’s not possible, I also pay road tax and all the other taxes, what amazes me is the frustration by car drivers, does it really matter that your journey take 30seconds longer?

Please remember that a little nudge with a car hurts quite a lot and only now after 4 months am I able to train again.

Also most bikers are quite well trained people so if you want to step away from your keyboards and voice your view’s be careful not all of us are tree huggers

Peace

Wes

[007]

My view is that I should be allowed to use the side of the road as long as I use the road carefully, which I do, and all I ask in return is that the Swedish law protects me fr ... (show full quote)

My view is that I should be allowed to use the side of the road as long as I use the road carefully, which I do, and all I ask in return is that the Swedish law protects me from people with a fixation on hating cyclists. Yes, there are some bad cyclists, just as there are some bad drivers, but that doesn't give the right to try and kill someone with your car. A car is a deadly weapon when used in a certain manner and drivers have a responsibility to use their vehicles with the necessary care to prevent it becoming a weapon. They can not take the law in to their own hands, and I am trying to find out if they are even basing their actions on law or a personal opinion. ... (hide full quote)

i have been living with this for 20 years, longer for my swede. i have often offered people who threaten my life when they 'want to teach a lesson' for us to go to the police together. i will take the fine for whatever offense they accuse me of, and they can face prosecution for attempted murder or some somewhat lesser plea.

cycling up Sveavägen in central Stockholm

i hate those narrow, raised paths on sveavägen. additionally to what you describe they are too narrow to overtake a slower cyclist. i always opt for the open road and ride offensively presuming cars are either not aware i can be there or that they might actually want to 'threaten' me.

I find the views of many of you appalling and a the view that its ok to run over bikers.. Wes

i agree. over the years, the vitriol for cyclists has increased for whatever reason. i have had people confront me for walking my bike (forgetting that i am a pedestrian at that point.)

sorry to hear you were injured, wes. glad you are healing.

and fwiw, in my 20 years of daily commuting by cycle, i do find that most people are rather cooperative. but i ride rather 'communicatively'. i look people in the eyes (pedestrians, motorists, cyclists) and i ride with consideration to the fact that we are all on the roads; we need to work it out. normally i even have taxi drivers extending me courtesies and people smiling and waving back. sounds incredible i know, but it does happen.

i like the idea of a helmet cam (GoPro or the like) and would be interested to hear what the police would have to say if you filed a police report against aggressors. you should do it.

[rg255]

i ride rather 'communicatively'. i look people in the eyes (pedestrians, motorists, cyclists) and i ride with consideration to the fact that we are all on the roads; w ... (show full quote)

i ride rather 'communicatively'. i look people in the eyes (pedestrians, motorists, cyclists) and i ride with consideration to the fact that we are all on the roads; we need to work it out. normally i even have taxi drivers extending me courtesies and people smiling and waving back. sounds incredible i know, but it does happen. ... (hide full quote)

I also do this - never trust that someone has seen me (despite riding with high visibility jersey and lights always on) unless I have made clear eye contact. It has the same effect for me too, generally drivers appreciate the fact your are clearly being proactive in keeping the roads safe.

[rg255]

I find the views of many of you appalling and a the view that its ok to run over bikers.In June of this year I had an accident involving a car that didn’t see me on the bike ... (show full quote)

I find the views of many of you appalling and a the view that its ok to run over bikers.

In June of this year I had an accident involving a car that didn’t see me on the bike path, I tore both my knee ligaments had inflammation in both arms and 3 cracked ribs, is this OK?

I am also a road biker and where possible I use the bike path but on many areas it’s not possible, I also pay road tax and all the other taxes, what amazes me is the frustration by car drivers, does it really matter that your journey take 30seconds longer?

Please remember that a little nudge with a car hurts quite a lot and only now after 4 months am I able to train again.

Also most bikers are quite well trained people so if you want to step away from your keyboards and voice your view’s be careful not all of us are tree huggers

Peace

Wes ... (hide full quote)

Sounds awful Wes, I have a friend who was knocked off her bike last week, broke a bone in her foot and is now on crutches - driver didn't even stop.

[Rick Methven]

Actually you can easily check with trafikverket and they will tell you that cyclists cause a lot more accidents than drivers. Which is why they should seriously force cyclists ... (show full quote)

Actually you can easily check with trafikverket and they will tell you that cyclists cause a lot more accidents than drivers. Which is why they should seriously force cyclists to apply for courses and take licenses before they cycle. In any case if a cyclist gets hurt then I have no sympathy for them. They are very reckless and often just inches away from hitting pedestrians even in parks. ... (hide full quote)

Proof of your allegations?

Stockholm is certainly not green my friend. It's all propaganda. The truth is the lakes are filled with industrial waste from 60's, the baltic sea is dead, they cut do ... (show full quote)

Stockholm is certainly not green my friend. It's all propaganda. The truth is the lakes are filled with industrial waste from 60's, the baltic sea is dead, they cut down more forrests every year, the agricultural land is filled with chemicals harmful for wildlife, the garbage collection is not sorted out as thought by the companies etc. Every green proposal they make makes life more expensive and ineffective with the purpose of that proposal. There was even a news item that green party members create more waste than the rest cuz they often have old cars. ... (hide full quote)

More proof, or are you just trolling again?

My old arthritic bones and a broken hip no longer permit me the pleasure of riding my bike. Nowadays the only one I get to ride is the fixed one in the Gym. This does not change me from pro to anti cycling as I know that riding a bike is much better for your health than sitting in your car and I admire those hardy souls that I see riding down into the city on a cold frosty morning, knowing that they will have a long hard slog back home in the evening up a very long hill!

Those who deride and complain about cyclists should try driving their cars in Amsterdam where the car driver has less rights than the pedestrian. Trams in my day had red bumpers, supposedly not to show the blood, not of cyclists but of pedestrians which it was OK to run over, as was smashing into a car, but if a tram driver damaged a bike he could be lynched from the nearest lamppost to the cheers of 99.99% of the local population.

[AgeOfReason]

Proof of your allegations?

The posting I gave earlier from DN article that explains a little about how there are more injuries with cycle accidents than motor vehicle, and around 70-80% of cycle accidents are cyclists on their own, only 20% of cycle accidents involve
motor vehicles.

http://www.dn.se/nyheter/sverige/fler-skad...n-i-bilolyckor/

[rg255]

That article is about injuries. It says that the main reason is because cars have been made safer by manufacturers whereas cyclists are as prone as they've always been. Perhaps you can try again or learn to do your research before you start preaching from your keyboard.

[AgeOfReason]

Right back at ya!
The very fact that it is safer to travel by motor vehicle compared to cycles could be used as a reasonable argument that in the interest of public safety cyclists should not be allowed to cycle until their equipment is indeed safer. Especially since the majority of cycle accidents have only the cyclist to blame! The report stands. Best watch out in case your head inflates too much and you can't fit ya helmet on

[rg255]

No, more accidents *that result in injury* involve cyclists. This is because motorists have a big metal box around them. A greater proportion of the accidents bikes are involved in will result in an injury than those with cars. Think about all those bumps and scrapes to cars which are not reported here because they do not constitute major injuries. Cyclists causing their own accidents is also no reason for them to be on the cycle paths instead of the road. I believe it has been shown that it is no safer for a cyclist to be on the cycle path than the road.

You originally stated that "cyclists cause a lot more accidents" - a statement you are yet to back up with evidence.

Further, this still doesn't clarify the law on cycling on the road which is what this thread is about, so if you can't help to provide a useful answer then I suggest you pipe the f**k down.

[vicky7]

I find the views of many of you appalling and a the view that its ok to run over bikers.In June of this year I had an accident involving a car that didn’t see me on the bike ... (show full quote)

I find the views of many of you appalling and a the view that its ok to run over bikers.

In June of this year I had an accident involving a car that didn’t see me on the bike path, I tore both my knee ligaments had inflammation in both arms and 3 cracked ribs, is this OK?

I am also a road biker and where possible I use the bike path but on many areas it’s not possible, I also pay road tax and all the other taxes, what amazes me is the frustration by car drivers, does it really matter that your journey take 30seconds longer?

Please remember that a little nudge with a car hurts quite a lot and only now after 4 months am I able to train again.

Also most bikers are quite well trained people so if you want to step away from your keyboards and voice your view’s be careful not all of us are tree huggers

Peace

Wes ... (hide full quote)

You would have to ask the driver who drove over you...

[Affonso]

It's not even a crime in this country to be drunk on a bicycle.

[AgeOfReason]

No, more accidents *that result in injury* involve cyclists. This is because motorists have a big metal box around them. A greater proportion of the accidents bikes are involv ... (show full quote)

No, more accidents *that result in injury* involve cyclists. This is because motorists have a big metal box around them. A greater proportion of the accidents bikes are involved in will result in an injury than those with cars. Think about all those bumps and scrapes to cars which are not reported here because they do not constitute major injuries. Cyclists causing their own accidents is also no reason for them to be on the cycle paths instead of the road. I believe it has been shown that it is no safer for a cyclist to be on the cycle path than the road. ... (hide full quote)

Exactly, it is safer to go by car than it is to cycle, so one could argue that if the number of injuries is so high that it isn't in the public interest to let them on the roads, let alone the cycle paths. The recklessness of cyclists in the city has reached a point where here in Stockholm the police have started actions where they catch them speeding through pedestrian zones and thankfully handing them fines. If cyclists were more responsible rather than believing they can do as they please, then we could have those police resources deployed to other activities. Maybe indeed it is time to have a cycle tax/charge

You originally stated that "cyclists cause a lot more accidents" - a statement you are yet to back up with evidence.

Did I, please pop my quote here so I can see that!

Further, this still doesn't clarify the law on cycling on the road which is what this thread is about, so if you can't help to provide a useful answer then I suggest you pipe the f**k down.

You got the clarification of the law right back on page 1. Law is not black and white it is about argument and interpretation. Since you seem to be rather emotional and quick to aggressive (angry) outbursts, just maybe, you should reconsider cycling on the roads as it could be dangerous for yourself and others