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Posted by: Grommet 9.Jun.2020, 05:03 AM

So the US is in quite a sorry state these days. Corona basically is out-of-hand, and now, what has become a global effort against prejudice in the memory of George Floyd, causing riots and looting, and essentially total social unrest.

And I start to see calls to "defund the police" and words like "we must end systemic/institutionalised racism now".

Will defunding police really help bring about some form of correction? What does "end institutionalised racism" really mean? How can it be done?

Do people really think everyone will drop their deep-rooted prejudices overnight? Will defunding police units magically unzip their bias/hatred?

I agree something needs to be done, no doubt about it. But I start to see the useless "Greta effect" here. For shame? Do so many people have the shame and humility to really put something effective into place? To change their ways?

Is it the way to go, to try to shame people into changing? Does it work?

For only one example, how to stop "prejudice" when it has been monetised? Private prisons for profit, with 80-90% occupancy by people of colour. The prison "worker" union is one of the richest and largest lobby groups in the US. They have power.

Armed citizens (and by armed I mean military styled fully automatic assault rifles) occupying government buildings?

WTF? This stuff has been going on since forever. Is kneeling in protest, going to fix it?

Can there be any will to fix this sh#t when so many seem to benefit from it?

The ones who really have the spirit to fix it, have no power.

What needs to be done?

Posted by: Grommet 11.Jun.2020, 07:12 PM

This seems like a good start:

https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/trump-campaign-demands-cnn-apologize-for-poll-that-shows-biden-leading-1.4979462

Probably a good idea for "POTUS" to show such elegance and class as he has done here.

"After CNN released the poll earlier this week, Trump tweeted that he had hired Republican pollster McLaughlin & Associates to "analyze" the survey and others "which I felt were FAKE based on the incredible enthusiasm we are receiving.""

Trump is indeed a whale of a catch!

Posted by: Gimp 11.Jun.2020, 11:32 PM

Posted by: Gimp 11.Jun.2020, 11:42 PM

Posted by: Grommet 12.Jun.2020, 04:17 AM

This is what I mean. How will balancing out economic inequality change a bigoted, "black person" hating cop?

Taking away resources from police, can also be dangerous (and no, I don't think police need armoured tanks or basic officers that dress in SWAT gear, during their regular patrolling). But how will kneeling in support (indeed a beautiful gesture) bring "real" necessary change in the way people treat other people?

Do you ever watch Trevor Noah? I do, and often, and this video which I found eventually, really homed in on that point. This thing isn't going to be fixed with symbols and gestures.

Damn, can't find that again (will post it here if I do), but he gets it that "real" things need to happen, not just virtue signalling, ya know?

This can't be degraded to Twitter fights and it can't become a fanatical SJW thing, needs real substance. But where is it?

Posted by: Gimp 12.Jun.2020, 04:45 AM

Posted by: Grommet 12.Jun.2020, 05:02 AM

Yes, and the piece I was looking for, Noah vocalises how much has actually been happening, in just 2 weeks, but acknowledges that people need to "do", not just talk.

I was just searching for that one, but soooo many to sift through, hopefully I will come across it again soon.

But I did find this, which as a Canadian, I found pretty hilarious, apparently uploaded only a couple hours ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtwzCmLo0yY

Posted by: Gimp 12.Jun.2020, 06:02 AM

Posted by: Grommet 12.Jun.2020, 06:25 AM

Yes, and beware of the mighty Canadian military Zambonis...they will clean your ice up in NO time! Um, you can understand me with my weird accent, right?

Ya, this is why I must find this Noah piece. He applauds the discussion, as do I, but realises we need actions, not just words.

There is a mild (or not even so mild, see what happens when you are a First Nations person and have been stopped by police with expired licence plates in Canada: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQIP4SKC8Zk) form of "apartheid" in Canada, and I would say what's going on in the US is as bad or even quite a bit worse. As far as I know, no Canadian journalist has been taken down in Canada, whilst reporting on the Floyd demonstrations there.

Anyway, let's hope, as Noah says, that the words turn into real meaningful "actions".

Posted by: Gamla Hälsingebock 12.Jun.2020, 02:52 PM

Why don't you guys just PM each other...nobody else reads/cares about this thread...

Waiting for your most comedic replies now

Posted by: Gimp 12.Jun.2020, 04:12 PM

QUOTE (Gamla H?lsingebock @ 12.Jun.2020, 02:52 PM)

Why don't you guys just PM each other...nobody else reads/cares about this thread...

Waiting for your most comedic replies now

Posted by: Grommet 14.Jun.2020, 07:24 AM

Well, maybe things are moving:

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/13/us/changes-from-protests-george-floyd-trnd/index.html

Knowing how things can go, if a "non-white" meets up with America's finest, its maybe not a good idea either, to grab the cops' tazer. I don't think colour would really be a factor anymore, if the one in question, grabs one of the weapons of the cops, even if being harassed.

See "Atlanta Police Chief to Resign After Shooting of Black Man" here: https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/protests-george-floyd-death-2020-06-13

Posted by: Gimp 14.Jun.2020, 07:27 AM

Posted by: Grommet 14.Jun.2020, 02:37 PM

You know how during some demonstrations/marches (i.e. riots), whole bus loads of people come in just to loot and cause mayhem? Well, not only did they destroy businesses owned by "non-whites", but they give cause to their opponents, right?

Seems like this has also happened in turn to the image of the police. They are shown to be severely heavy handed even with reporters clearly marked as "Journalist". The police over-reacted and went full jar-head on anyone and everyone at certain (many) demonstrations.

Video of throwing down on a (frail looking) 75 year-old man, who afterwards lay motionless on the concrete and bleeding out of his ear. (You know, the one Trump mused was "blocking police communications" and "fell harder than he was pushed").

I would say that seals the deal, at least in some places. Police can't continuously keep justifying yelling "resisting arrest" just because the "suspect" wobbles after being pushed off their legs, resulting in their being tackled and then punched out. Or much worse, as we have all seen.

It could be those POSs will have to start to account for their sins. No one is buying their fabricated explanations.

That would be a great outcome, for everybody.

Posted by: Gimp 14.Jun.2020, 05:11 PM

Posted by: Grommet 16.Jun.2020, 04:55 AM

Did you see old man Fonzie give a rant on behalf of the men in blue? It is quite hopeless to think they will change, based on how they spun the whole accountability issue.

And I didn't realise until seeing that press conference, and the coverage surrounding it, that the only union stronger than the prison workers union, is the police union.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEKxo3bWtjU Skip ahead to ~2:20, the first guy is too muffled to hear, but then the Fonz comes out to the mic...

"The hatred towards the law enforcement is misguided"

Well, could be, but law enforcement is misguided in treating every single person they interact with, as a criminal.

Posted by: Gimp 16.Jun.2020, 03:44 PM

Posted by: Grommet 19.Jun.2020, 03:57 AM

Now there's a nasty piece. He lays it out really well, as only a real bastard could do.

Explains very much about policing in the USA. And with the power of the union behind them, it looks like they have things pretty much covered.

Unfortunately, history dictates that removal of such treachery, requires more violence, since it isn't likely they will just abandon their illegitimate post voluntarily.

And change from the inside? How many stories of police speaking up about the illegal things their partners do? Where does it end? The dismissal and harassment of the whistle-blower.

How the US allows it to happen (such powerful unions) in the first place, is the main question. And the answer is $$$ and power.

The US, known for "war for profit" in the first instance, since every bullet fired is profit. And then mix that with its eternal plan of economic imperialism...you end in the mess we see today, yesterday, last year and the decades before.